I would like to resume work on the basement bathroom. I am getting stuck on some startup questions and would like your advice before I begin.

Thanks in advanced!

Startup Questions:

1. The rough in Shower drain is situated very close to the wall and I'd like to relocate to somewhere in the center. The desired location is about 1.5 ft away. The approx size of the shower area is 3'x3'.

- How easy/difficult is it to break the concrete? The estimated thickness is around 2.5".
- Can this be done using a cold chisel with the mallet or should I rent the hammer type power tool? I went to Home Depot and the rental staff suggested to consider cold chisel since it was a small job???

2. Once shower rough in is relocated, what type of concrete should be used to cover the opening? I plan to use Kerdi sheet to seal the base and kerdi drain to minimize cutting of tiles since Kerdi Drain can be adjusted. Can I cover the opened area and build the shower base at the same time or do they need to be done separately? Does it use the same cement?

3. The Denseshield board has already been installed on the walls. Can I simply cover exposed areas with kerdi sheets - for example, the corners, screw areas OR do I need to put kerdi from the bottom to the top of the walls?

Here is a picture of the current bathroom area. The roughin is way to the right. The 2x4 arrangement shows the desired shape of the neo-angled bathroom layout.

If you want a really good workout, use a hammer and chisel. 30 minutes with a demo hammer will accomplish more that three hours with a hammer and chisel. You can always try it with the chisel and rent the demo hammer if/when you find it necessary.

You can refill the trench with regular bagged concrete, but you'll want to leave a hole around the drain pipe to allow for the Kerdi drain to set to the proper height. If you're planning to use the Kerdi tray, you'll want to finish the concrete as smooth and flush with the old concrete as much as possible. If you're putting in a mud floor, the concrete doesn't have to be so neat.

I don't have any experience with Denshield, so you may want to wait for someone else with experience to answer that question. I think in the past, their advice has been to cover the seams and fasteners, then cover the floor and up the wall a few inches with Kerdi.

One thing you might want to consider with regard to the step is to remove the lumber and replace it with brick or concrete. Schluter recommends this when building a step over a slab. The reason for this is that when you completely encapsulate lumber with Kerdi (except for the bottom side, of course), moisture migration from the concrete can cause the lumber to swell, which is something you don't want. Brick and mortar are not affected by moisture, and therefore make a more suitable substrate.

Is there any way to make the shower larger? Try your luck breaking the slab. Do you know which way the pipes run?

Kevin is right about Kerdi over Dens walls. Just liquid membrane on seams and any other perforations. I would flash the Kerdi up the walls about 6-8" or so. You do not want Kerdi over Dens cuz Dens has a plastic surface, could create vapor problems.

Jaz

In my experience the easiest way to break a slab is to use a grinder and a diamond turbo blade to cut two parallel lines about an inch deep where you and the pipe to go. have a helper with a good shop vac suck up the dust as you cut. Use both hands on the grinder to avoid kickback.

I have worked with dens for many years. Seems to me that you don't have enough fasteners holding it in place. There should be a screw every 8 to 10 inches. All seams and fasteners need to be water proofed. this is normally done with Redgard, or Hydroban liquid water proofing, but dabs of silicone for the screws and a kerdi strip for the corner will work too. There should have been no drywall mud anywhere in the shower.

fill the trench with post haste and then do the sloped mortar bed with topping mix of a very dry consistency. bond the mortar to the concrete with a thin layer of thinset. Since you are doing kerdi, you can nail in a screed strip of 3/8 plywood about 1.5 inches above the floor all around and leave it in. at the drain the mortar should be about 3/4" thick.

Thanks for all your responses!

The Bathroom area cannot be made larger since walls are in place. The bath room size is around 6.5'x6.5' feet.

Based on pictures taken during house construction, the pipes are directed per red lines.



Question about centering the toilet pipe.
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Also note that the 3" pipe for the toilet is not perfectly centered between the planned shower section and the wall. I will have to move it about 4-5 inches towards the side wall (right)to get a perfect center. Based on your experience - should I bother with moving the toilet roughin to get a perfect center? Once the tiles and finishing are in place, would it look funny to have the toilet non-centered? I am planning to use glass walls on the shower. We thought about adding some corner shelving furniture to disguise the non centered toilet. I'm a bit hesitant to break the concrete /move the toilet pipe 5" and not sure if I can even do that without changing too much of the underlying pipes.

Hoping to hear your expert advice if its worth centering the toilet.

I wouldn't bother with it, but that's just my opinion. That extra space looks like a good place for a magazine rack....or a television.

Rented a power tool to help crack open the concrete. It took less than 2 hours to get to this stage. It appears that the pipe is connecting to the toilet rough-in piping rather than to the main pipe as initially thought



Question on the Toilet rough-in.
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While I have the power tool, do I need to crack open the cement around the 3" toilet rough-in to be able to install the flange? I think there are two different flange types, one that fits inside and another that fits outside the 3" pipe. Which one should I use? Note that the 3"pipe is 10" center away from the wall. I was planning to use the 10" rough-in toilets for this.

I was also considering using an offset flange to shift the location of the toilet towards the right to make it less off centered. Do you know how much distance I can gain using the offset flange? Is it ok to use it?

Question on cement
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Wondering how many cement bags I would need to fill the opening? I plan to put back the stones then cover with concrete. do I need to leave the stones to settle for some time before applying the cement?


Thanks again!!!

I think if you're planing on breaking out concrete for the toilet flange you might as well go all the way and offset a new flange the correct distance from the wall along with centering the rough-in between the shower and the wall.
An offset toilet flange will only give you approx. 1-1/2"of offset.

After you refill the hole, measure the final width,length and depth to calculate the cubic inches. Convert that measurement to cubic feet. Each bag of concrete mix will give you .5 cubic feet of cement.

Pack the fill in the trench as best as possible. Be careful around the pipes so that you don't alter the slope.

On a side note, I see that the DensShield has been paper taped in the corner. This needs to be removed along with any other drywall compound that's within the shower area.

Is your bathroom ready now? We would like to see.

I agree, this looks like quite a project. I hope that you used the tool to your advantage and open all the concrete you needed to. How did the plumbing turn out?